Topic: Merge the axe and club skills  (Read 806 times)


Bert Preast

« on: May 31, 2022, 01:15:56 AM »
Club skill covers skill with maces, and is there really a difference in fighting style between a mace and axe?  Only that with the axe you want to hit your enemy with the sharp bit - but if you can't stop your weapon spinning in your grip when using it then frankly you should probably not be fighting anything.

I would propose that the combat skills axe and club be merged.

This would free up a slot for a skill I feel is lacking, a "Fighting" combat skill.  This should start at zero and tick up every time something hits or tries to hit the character.  The skill would have no effect in isolation, but every 4 or 5 points in it should add a point to all the other weapon skills, perhaps excluding bow and crossbow. 

The skill would simulate experience gained while being in an actual fight.  After all, if an expert swordsman and veteran of many battles has to make do with an axe for whatever reason, he is still going to be a much more fearsome foe than someone similar who has never been in a scrap before.

JP_Finn

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« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2022, 05:40:21 AM »
Club also includes all generic item attacks: rocks, stones, branches, stakes, slender trunk etc. Both melee and thrown. 

Club as a separate from axe with that in mind makes more than sense to me.
Unless you believe renaming Club to “all generic junk, except clubs that are now under axes” is still needed, I’m interested on learning more.  ???

JP_Finn

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« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2022, 05:47:41 AM »
As for Fighting skill separately, I don’t see how spear fighting experience relates fighting with a flail or that to fighting with a knife.

It almost feels like incorporating “character level” akin to D&D—>AD&D—>D&D yet again, fighter that somehow swinging a sword get better at attacking with spears and bows because they defeated x amount of enemies. Which I recall* is not where the Elks want their game to go.

As per “freeing up a slot” for other skill; I’m sure the Elks can add more skills as needed. Textile craft was added in 3.70. Survival was removed sometime ago. Ritual was removed before Survival.

*from years ago, not sure if it was some interview for a radio on one of the anniversaries or ‘just’ a gaming magazine interview.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2022, 06:07:53 AM by JP_Finn »

Tinker

« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2022, 10:58:55 AM »
I do not agree with any simplification, if you continue on that line you end with just an attack skill and a defence skill.

I would prefer to see many more skills, I can think of 20 skills to add, as an example throwing something could be a separate skill just to hit the target, damage done would depend on what you threw and how accurate your throwing is.

PALU

« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2022, 11:07:18 AM »
Without any personal experience, I believe there are a number of things that are common to all kinds of fighting, such as how to move efficiently, keep all parts of yourself away from enemy reach as much as possible, bio mechanical knowledge (i.e. what you can expect to be able to do/not do), detection of incoming threats (which can be considered part of dodge/block), etc.

However, that doesn't necessarily have to be modeled.

It can be noted that just whacking away with an axe as if it was a club is probably going to be rather useless, as an axe requires proper edge alignment to hit properly. Also, the targets suitable for a club strike are different from those suitable for an axe strike.

Bert Preast

« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2022, 07:20:50 PM »
Lots of food for thought in the replies above. 

JP Finn:  I admit I forgot to consider that club includes chucking rocks, branches, kitchen sinks etc at the enemy.  A throwing skill is needed then!  Still, i disagree that experience in fighting with one weapon type does not confer a measure of skill when fighting with a differing weapon type.

Tinker:  Yes, a throwing skill should definitely be a thing.  I would love to hear the 20 skills you would like to add!

Palu:  I agree about there being many things common to fighting in general which will make the combatant more effective with any weapon.  However I do think it needs modelling.  Also an axe handle is shaped so the edgy bit is naturally what you strike with.  I chopped a fair few logs, and can remember sometimes missing altogether, but never having the axe spin in my hand!