UnReal World forums
UnReal World => Gameplay questions => Topic started by: GrimmSpector on May 23, 2023, 09:43:59 PM
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Logically I would expect Winter Fur to be a higher Warmth value than non Winter Fur, is there any confirmation on this for clothing made of it?
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Yes, clothes made from winter fur is warmer. You'll notice it more with bigger animals like bear or elk. I don't remember if the effect is visible for squirrel fur, but it might be. You can examine clothes in your inventory individually to see how warm they are.
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Yes, clothes made from winter fur is warmer. You'll notice it more with bigger animals like bear or elk. I don't remember if the effect is visible for squirrel fur, but it might be. You can examine clothes in your inventory individually to see how warm they are.
Cool, thanks. Makes me more sad that I cannot produce higher quality clothing out of higher quality furs.
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You can always edit diy_glossary to use textilecraft, not common. Or give the COMMON 20% skill increase.
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the clothing you produce will still be warmer than summer fur clothing, even though the quality will still be listed as decent (unless you make the edits JP_Finn suggests).
In real life, it would take a month or more to sew a high quality coat by hand. It's faster with a sewing machine (which your character doesn't have access to) but still takes an unbelievable amount of time. You can spend an entire day just getting the pins in place so the fabric won't move around while you're sewing it. But in the game it's not yet implemented that a task could take a month and be put down and picked up again.
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You can always edit diy_glossary to use textilecraft, not common. Or give the COMMON 20% skill increase.
Mine is empty cuz I'm using BAC lol, I don't know what's supposed to live in this file to be honest. But I imagine the pieces that may be relevant here are in the BAC textilecraft/armor/clothing files! I think they're already changed by it. I just haven't managed to produce anything that doesn't suck lol
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To be able to make ‘fine’ items the skill +- modifier of the crafting recipe needs to be 40, to get ‘masterwork’/‘superior’ items the threshold is 70. And of course there’s a RNG/dice roll for success. You’ve seen the “can’t make good out of bad” prompts: those are from succeeding your roll, but the base material limits the output.
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To be able to make ‘fine’ items the skill +- modifier of the crafting recipe needs to be 40, to get ‘masterwork’/‘superior’ items the threshold is 70. And of course there’s a RNG/dice roll for success. You’ve seen the “can’t make good out of bad” prompts: those are from succeeding your roll, but the base material limits the output.
So as an example here,
.Leather laced shoes. "Leather shoes" [effort:2] [phys:arms] *HIDEWORKING* /90/ %20%
That would still only produce maximum of decent quality, but if it were %40% it could do fine?
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That *HIDEWORKING* calls your characters hideworking skill. The %20% adds 20pts to your characters skill. So with skill 20, you have a slim chance of getting fine shoes; when crafting from fine or superior leather. With skill 50, your character has a slim chance of getting, masterwork shoes, IF crafting from superior leather. Somewhere around 50-60 combined skill (not sure) you won't get any harsh products. (except if using harsh materials)
and that /90/ is the time, in minutes, it takes for the recipe to finish.
If you'd add [noquality] tag on a recipe ingredient, that would allow lower level to produce higher level goods. Apart from timber, I'd say that's cheating. But it's your game, play as you want to.
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IIRC [noquality] only stops harsh and crappy things from reducing the quality.
It does need the skill boost to make a higher item.
Hmmm the BAC Smithing has a "refine" iron step where you spend time reworking iron to make not so crappy.
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The BAC smithung refine iron does have some drawbacks, the first being it will pick the best quality you have in your inventory or on the ground. The second thing is the skill level can produce ppoor or inferior items, even from a fine input. You need to be careful to only have low quality. inputs on or near you
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IIRC [noquality] only stops harsh and crappy things from reducing the quality.
--snip
[noquality] allows you to make Fine ski stick: 1st ingredient is {Slender trunk}(always decent) and other item is {Leather}[noquality]
I've never used fine or superior leather to craft ski sticks. Yet I get Fine with Fine axe. Above the quality level of used material.
Also, it's not visible recipe, but you can make Perfect boards from (decent) trunks with good enough skill and Fine Woodsman's or Fine Splitting axe. Above the level of ingredient or tools.
And getting Superior skins with Fine Broad knife. The list goes on.
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The BAC smithung refine iron does have some drawbacks, the first being it will pick the best quality you have in your inventory or on the ground. The second thing is the skill level can produce ppoor or inferior items, even from a fine input. You need to be careful to only have low quality. inputs on or near you
The issue is likely using a * wildcard on the {requirement}, one way to force selection is to add (1) [ask_num] on that ingredient line.
E.g.
.Travel soup. *COOKERY* /30/ \45\ %20% :148:
{* cut} (3)[ask_num]'Piece of meat' [remove] [boil] [name:%s meat travel soup]
...
That allows you to use dried, smoked, "raw", spoiled(still get you barfing) cut of any animal, without the (3) you could overfill the pot, and without the [ask_num] the recipe would pull any cut nearby, then under you, then from top down in the inventory. Without the [name:], raw meat soup would come out oddly named, it'd drop the 'X travel soup' and be simply 'pot of elk'
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Yes, clothes made from winter fur is warmer. You'll notice it more with bigger animals like bear or elk. I don't remember if the effect is visible for squirrel fur, but it might be. You can examine clothes in your inventory individually to see how warm they are.
Doesn't seem to actually be a thing, almost got existed since it would have meant less "hunt the rare piece of fine/masterwork clothing from Driik/Reemi shops" for optimal winter wear (especially for the smaller characters).
Tested by creating a pair of new Owl tribe characters in 3.80, one in autumn and one in winter and then hunting and skinning an elk. Fine elk winter fur (hunted in Dirt month) made into clothing with decent yarn bought from shop resulted in elk fur clothing with warmth of 5. Decent elk fur (hunted in Harvest month) made into clothing with decent store bought yarn resulted in elk fur clothing with warmth of 5. I verified both were actually 5 (rather than 4 as yellow means both 4 and 5 on the armour coverage screen) by seeing that both produced 8 (dark green) when overlapping with linen clothing.
So you'll still need to get those fine+ generic fur mittens, footwear and hood from shop for your winter clothing. For the rest, furs are at best temporary solution even if fine, since they are weight inefficient for warmth when compared to even regular quality wool/linen/nettle clothing.
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Thanks for looking into it! Maybe it's changed over the years. I'd be interested in a trial with bear fur, too.
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This is a really weird and kind of complicated subject. Wish it were a little clearer.
From what I can tell as well, there appears to be no difference in warmth with winter fur - only market value. Since it's not mentioned in the changelog, I'm guessing that hasn't been implemented.
So just checking: even with Fine small knife, Fine fur and Fine cordage... it is impossible to craft Fine fur clothing, right? Because, looking at diy_glossary, all clothing creation uses the common skill and none of the fur clothing recipes come with a built-in bonus but fur cap - which has 15%. And you need a 20% bonus? I just tried about a dozen times with a fine small knife + fine bear fur and only got decent fur caps.
I read in the wiki that Common skill is always base 60. But I read in many places on the forum - here included - it is said that you need base 40 to make fine items. Sooo... what's going on?
Also - and this is the first time this happened to me - I recently made a Fine Raft with a masterwork handaxe and fine spruce wythes. How is that possible?
IS it possible to make fine bear fur clothing with a masterwork knife? If so, then I've really got to find a masterworking smith.
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IS it possible to make fine bear fur clothing with a masterwork knife? If so, then I've really got to find a masterworking smith.
Player made clothes are capped at decent (at last without mods). Also note that quality only boosts (IIRC) warmth and blunt resistance of fur clothing (which are already weaker on bear fur than generic fur). It doesn't boost point or edge resistance, unlike leather and the metals.
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Is it? The wiki says generic fur and bear fur are the same except bear fur is better vs Tear. Is there a game file I can check or are people just comparing manually with layers in-game?
This all seems needlessly opaque in addition to needlessly complicated. I understand warmth... but why blunt? Why not anything else?
I understand that hideworking isn't tailoring, but I fail to see how a grandmaster hideworker could fail to produce a superior cloak out of bear fur than "generic fur" he scavenged off a dead bandit.
My mind is open, but there really needs to be a better explanation of this. What kind of fur is "generic fur" such that it's apparently superior to anything else we can see in-game?
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Is it? The wiki says generic fur and bear fur are the same except bear fur is better vs Tear. Is there a game file I can check or are people just comparing manually with layers in-game?
Some people have probably snooped the game code at various time but I don't know how to do so. You can see armour values in-game either on the armour coverage screen or by individually examining pieces of clothing in your inventory.
Those colour coded pictures at the start of http://unrealworld.fi/wiki/index.php?title=Clothing are extremely old. They were wrong a decade ago when they were on the old Wiki, if someone has Wiki account would be good idea to move them to the bottom of the article (which has similarly ancient stuff) or just remove them. The correct armour values are given in a text based table bit further down the article, and there is also legend for the colour codes used on the armour coverage screen above that. Only aspect missing from the Wiki are the bonuses clothing/armour get from quality. E.g. rough clothing (fur/cloth/wool) has -1 warmth, fine cloth clothing and leather get no boost, but there is a boost at masterwork, furs and wool get their bonus at fine already (easily missed on wool since it goes from 4 to 5 warmth, which are both colour coded yellow) and IIRC are no further buffed by masterwork. IIRC, mail is only buffed at masterwork, not sure about iron (helm, coudes) since it's pierce/edge resistance is out of scale.
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Is it? The wiki says generic fur and bear fur are the same except bear fur is better vs Tear. Is there a game file I can check or are people just comparing manually with layers in-game?
Some people have probably snooped the game code at various time but I don't know how to do so. You can see armour values in-game either on the armour coverage screen or by individually examining pieces of clothing in your inventory.
Those colour coded pictures at the start of http://unrealworld.fi/wiki/index.php?title=Clothing are extremely old. They were wrong a decade ago when they were on the old Wiki, if someone has Wiki account would be good idea to move them to the bottom of the article (which has similarly ancient stuff) or just remove them. The correct armour values are given in a text based table bit further down the article, and there is also legend for the colour codes used on the armour coverage screen above that. Only aspect missing from the Wiki are the bonuses clothing/armour get from quality. E.g. rough clothing (fur/cloth/wool) has -1 warmth, fine cloth clothing and leather get no boost, but there is a boost at masterwork, furs and wool get their bonus at fine already (easily missed on wool since it goes from 4 to 5 warmth, which are both colour coded yellow) and IIRC are no further buffed by masterwork. IIRC, mail is only buffed at masterwork, not sure about iron (helm, coudes) since it's pierce/edge resistance is out of scale.
Wow. Yes. Like i said, needlessly opaque and complicated.
Thank you for the heads up, though.
It looks like bear fur is still better on point and tear in any event, then... which means I don't anticipate swapping it out. I keep reading people on this forum saying that fur armor doesn't make sense in the long run, but I haven't been able to find any combination of armors that provides better all-around protection than a combo of bear fur and generic leather plus iron. Yeah it weighs a lot but it's better than an arrow to the gut.
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Fur armour makes sense, and yes especially bear fur with it's point resistance which can be otherwise hard to stack. But I don't really armour up for my everyday tasks anymore, except for the neck where mail cowl + fur hood is nice guarantee in case a wolf tries to stealth nibble you from behind (they always attack neck), which can be an unexpected instant death otherwise. If you are going out with intent to fight or hunt dangerous critters, then it's different.
What furs don't make much sense is warmth for winter wear, which is opposite of what one might expect.
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Fur armour makes sense, and yes especially bear fur with it's point resistance which can be otherwise hard to stack. But I don't really armour up for my everyday tasks anymore, except for the neck where mail cowl + fur hood is nice guarantee in case a wolf tries to stealth nibble you from behind (they always attack neck), which can be an unexpected instant death otherwise. If you are going out with intent to fight or hunt dangerous critters, then it's different.
What furs don't make much sense is warmth for winter wear, which is opposite of what one might expect.
My current setup is a 200lb guy who gets just barely under the 20lb limit with bear fur shirt, leggings, cowl, footwear and mittens plus woolen mittens and socks and leather belt... it does the job for everything but the absolute depth of winter.
Maybe if I was going for a hardcore winter outfit I'd layer wool on wool on linen or something? One of the things that's implied in the encyclopedia is that comfort affects the superstition state and linen helps with that. I wonder if there's any truth to that.