Topic: Trapped Crippled Beings Are Too Good At Dodging.  (Read 1221 times)


Owlant

« on: June 26, 2020, 07:46:46 PM »
I decided to do a seal hunter character. 6 seals so far and I had been using big dead fall traps and then finishing the seals off with a whack with my spear. (Grandmaster level skill in it.)

I decided to try kicking the beast and kept missing. Animals who have their limbs crushed and mangled. Those who are unable to move, with multiple fractures in their limbs and is currently buried under 10 14lb stones and 3 logs weighing 500lbs each are leaping out the way. I need to regularly drop my carry weight to under 20% to ensure I hit often.

I would like to ask, that the whole being crushed and crippled lowers their dodge ability more?



« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 07:55:00 PM by Owlant »

PALU

« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2020, 11:05:13 PM »
You should see them without that handicap :P

On the positive side, all those misses mean more opportunities to train unarmed combat.

Owlant

« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2020, 11:33:50 PM »
I just been hunting the rare ninja seals! That is my issue. Without all the bones broken, they back flip away like a 90's movie about a killer whale?  ;)

JP_Finn

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« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2020, 12:29:07 AM »
Your screenshot shows 86 point penalty... if your seal hunter has 100 Unarmed, then with load&fatigue; his/her effective skill is 14, unskilled novice at best. Might have difficulty hitting unlatched cabin door with a punch or kick.  ::)

PALU

« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2020, 09:50:07 AM »
Not only does an encumbrance penalty of 20% reduce your hit chances, but it also increases the fatigue buildup significantly. I'd expect the 86% penalty to be about 20% encumbrance and 66% fatigue (possibly from repeated attempt at kicking the animal). Dropping all carried stuff except the things you need to fight is a useful strategy, but you have to ensure you can find your stuff later if the enemy is mobile. In the case of an animal caught in a trap they're unlikely to go anywhere (but predators can still attack at melee range: I use blunt arrows against trapped wolves and bears, and often gluttons as well).

Owlant

« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2020, 11:45:19 AM »
Maybe it is a matter of game play response not reflecting the behind numbers.

Character aims a kick and misses. I can accept. It is based on my own inability.

Character aims a kick and the crippled animal who is unable to move and is trapped is effectively dodging said kick. I cannot understand.

Maybe the dodging is okay, but the game play messages need to reflect the situation better.






PALU

« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2020, 02:33:20 PM »
Well, it's an opposed check, with the animal doing it's best at getting out of the way of the inept kick. I fully agree that the seal should have no chance to affect the outcome in this case, but displaying it better would require the code to determine the cases where the "opposition" of the opposed check is completely ineffective, as opposed to almost completely ineffective. The melee hits are automatic when the the target is unconscious, for instance (although one might question whether someone fatigued to the brink of collapse would hit every time).

So, I agree in principle, but realize it might be tricky to balance code to handle it properly.

Sami

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« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2021, 05:59:28 PM »
I decided to do a seal hunter character. 6 seals so far and I had been using big dead fall traps and then finishing the seals off with a whack with my spear. (Grandmaster level skill in it.)

I decided to try kicking the beast and kept missing. Animals who have their limbs crushed and mangled. Those who are unable to move, with multiple fractures in their limbs and is currently buried under 10 14lb stones and 3 logs weighing 500lbs each are leaping out the way. I need to regularly drop my carry weight to under 20% to ensure I hit often.

I would like to ask, that the whole being crushed and crippled lowers their dodge ability more?

Occasionally combat results like this can happen, of which some are more off than others. In this specific scenario, given the trap and animal type, it indeed sounds like being more off than it should be. How to remedy all that, given that there needs to be generic combat rules and generic message output at the background, is more tricky thing. Easy option would be to disable dodging from animals in deadfall traps, but still some might in reality get eg. their head away of the slow and lousy kick - accidentally or not.
We may try to experiment with attacking different trapped animal at some point, but at least now I don't have all-round perfect adjustments in my mind.
- Sami | UnReal World creator

JP_Finn

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« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2021, 04:30:34 AM »
Master swordsman (90% skill, minor penalties), Fine broadsword, trapped eagle-owl.
Skilled strike: dodged.

 

anything