Topic: How come I can burn down forests while it's raining?  (Read 416 times)


« on: January 24, 2019, 02:21:32 AM »
I was trying to burn down the forest when it started raining. Granted it was light rain but to my surprise the fires still spread to adjacent tiles successfully.

Shouldn't the rain suppress the fires and stop them spreading?

Brygun

« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2019, 02:25:30 AM »
I was trying to burn down the forest when it started raining.

I bet you swear it was for agriculture!  ;)


« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2019, 03:35:49 AM »
I'm trying to see if it is actually possible to modify the tile from forest to open ground after burning down the entire forest...

Anyone else tried this b4?

Signatus

« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2019, 04:43:26 AM »
Fires can definitely rage in the rain. I believe the California fires weren't stopped by the rain. There was a wildfire in Canada a few years ago, I think, which took years to put out. If big enough, a bit of rainwater won't be enough to kill it. I think rain does affect how long the fires stay lit, but I'm not sure about that.

I think I read somewhere that you might be able to deforest a tile until it becomes Ground, but again, I might be wrong. I'm willing to bet it's just hardcoded.

Brygun

« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2019, 05:59:31 PM »
It might also matter on how the zoom out map works. If it generates its tile x/y is Z only at world creation then its not going to affect the zoomed out map. I suspect that is how it works mostly on a guess that was the easier to code many years ago before modding was a consideration.

Clearing a forest to ground could be used to improve zoomed out sight lines. For that to work the zoomed out map tile data would need to be updated each time you went to the map and moved on it. This is less likely to have been considered years ago.

Changing the tile tap to say "ground" would be noticed by recipe calls (at least I think so). Currently there aren't ones coming to mind that want the 100x100(?) map tile to be Ground. There are a few looking for the 2x2m square to be "ground". There are some that look for the 100x100 to be "mire" such as the bog ore recipe.


Signatus

« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2019, 06:14:11 PM »
Just wan to point out that a clearing in the middle of the forest is easier to find and navigate to than walking aimlessly through the forest. This could be a way to easily spot your farm without setting traps. I don't any other specific use for it at the moment, but a tile bereft of trees shouldn't get the benefits and flora of a grove or coniferous forest.

Brygun

« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2019, 06:42:32 PM »
I end up with a many temporary shelters on my map that serve a similiar purpose. At least on the world map they show up. finding them on the wilderness map can be problematic.

Certainly there are a few why-to for clearing land like this.

As to how-to-code I'm still up in the air on if its possible and if so if the different immediate, wilderness and world maps would update. Mostly as they probably never expected to ever need updating.


Signatus

« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2019, 07:07:17 PM »
Considering that right now the only thing causing a tile to change is deforestation, maybe only make that check whenever a tree is felled. If a certain percentage of agricultural field is present, and below a different one for the trees, it could turn to a Field.

This could make a difference when population and tribes interact more with the world. If they rotate the crop fields every few years or if they actually go out and fell trees, etc. Other than that, there isn't much use.

Edit: this might be problematic if map maintenance resets the tile and it generates stuff that wasn't there originally at all...
« Last Edit: January 24, 2019, 07:10:42 PM by Signatus »

Brygun

« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2019, 07:17:12 PM »
It could also have wonky though acceptable issues with plants, like herbs and berries, which AFAIK are generated when actually entering the tile on the local map. The terrain might change say from forest to open and the first set of plants being left there. Unless you terminated those plants then regenerated new plants.


Dungeon Smash

« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2019, 03:55:53 PM »
I am a real life wildland firefighter and I can tell you that forest fires can definitely burn in the rain.  It's quite common.

Large fires can be thousands of degrees in the interior, hot enough to melt steel.  Rain can't even touch it - the raindrops evaporate long before they touch the fire.  Even a single torching tree is hot enough to evaporate raindrops.

Of course, fire is complex and rain certainly helps to put it out.  It depends on numerous factors.  In Colorado, the fuels were receptive to rain and once it started raining, we could usually sit back and declare the situation under control.  In Alaska, when the rain came down, it was the exact opposite - we would often kick into high gear, because rain was our chance to catch the fire.  Those were some miserable times.... slogging through knee-deep bog water as the black spruce torched all around you

Now, as for starting the fires.... that might be a different story, it just depends on the skill level of the person starting it.  I've started plenty of campfires in the rain before, but it's certainly harder.  Using only prehistoric methods would increase the challenge even more.  Still, with enough fuel, you can burn anything...
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 03:57:37 PM by Dungeon Smash »

PALU

« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2019, 10:04:33 AM »
It can also be noted that Finland is in the temperate zone, so tropical level downpours are very rare (and probably never reach the really heavy level anyway).