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Messages - Saiko Kila

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General Discussion / Re: "Edible"
« on: May 16, 2019, 05:37:05 PM »
Just as it says on the tin... spoiled foods are, apparently, edible. (According to herblore, at least!)

Spoiler: show

IMO, it's interesting that nausea shows up on the herblore thing. Makes me wonder if it's possible to mod it in as a plant effect, or if it's strictly limited to spoiled foods.

It also makes the Noaidi's mushroom description a little more honest:

Spoiler: show

Add the tag "nausea" to a plant, it should give this effect. Haven't tested, but this is the keyword used by the game for this description.

By the way, my characters carry meadsweet beverage mostly to eat spoiled food with (almost) impunity, though this beverage also helps with cleaning and dressing wounds. It's like Most Essential Medicine for me, because spoiled food are very important source of nutrients to my characters. Especially spoiled fats is great. There are cultures which use them in real life...

General Discussion / Re: How to get burn damage?
« on: May 15, 2019, 06:18:29 PM »
So it is possible to actually get burns by accident? ;)
I think this is the rarest type of injury, even less frequent than frostbite (which requires no clothing on a body part and a really low temperature).

As for dogs, I'm not sure they would be burned at all. I frequently call forest maidens, which requires a burning stack. Since my char is always surrounded by animals, and they cannot move aside (because of crowding), they often land on the burning tile when my char goes to sleep. They never get damaged. Maybe this is handled separately by game code.

Anyway, I found out that burning injuries are the most convenient ones for training Physician skill. This is because they give opportunity to either apply a compress (minor wounds) or both clean and apply a compress (serious wounds). Applying a compress has a +2 bonus to learning. Cleaning doesn't have such bonus, the same with treating frostbite. Another one treatment which has such high chance of learning is stopping bleeding, but bleeding injury is both difficult to obtain and dangerous.

Using cheap armour allows to protect selected body parts (except eyes, unfortunately) against too much burn damage. It works for every type of damage, but is easier for burns.

Previously I used bruises from falling off trees, but they apparently always have only the compress treatment available, never cleaning (because they are blunt damage) and even though cleaning is just a standard chance to learn, it's still better to have two chances per injury per day than one.

The only inconvenience is that all burn damages, including minor, are yellow level status at maximum when treated by player (even with all-healing herbs), and can be upgraded only to celadon level by sage,  the same as frostbite. Which means than it won't heal so quickly if unlucky. But that could be the point, if used for learning.

General Discussion / Re: How to get burn damage?
« on: May 15, 2019, 01:33:08 PM »
Thanks. I did a pattern of 5x5 and stood in the centre. Each tile had several spruces and a slender trunk, without trunk they were unable to burn long enough for the central tile to catch fire. Actually before it caught fire the off-side tiles were mostly finished, so after getting too burned to move I crawled to one of these places, there was no need for zooming out. Also I had to remove armour, because apparently it protects heavily against fire.

General Discussion / How to get burn damage?
« on: May 15, 2019, 10:05:42 AM »
I wanted to test healing of burn damage. However, I can't really get my character burnt. Is there a trick to it? Maybe like giving a lit torch to a guy and attacking him? Are there enemies using fire (some have torches,  but unlit)? Characters cannot enter fire tiles, and fire doesn't seem to spread easily to an occupied tile.

General Discussion / Re: Exploit - overloaded traders
« on: May 09, 2019, 03:11:42 PM »
This actually hasn't been the case since introduction of limited carry weight for NPCs since that's been active for a decade or two, or who knows for how long.

By "limited carry weight" I mean the solution that was introduced in 3.52 - that they drop down excessive stuff (allowing PC to recover them - hence the exploit), instead of trying to stuff their pockets and "disappearing" items (which technically was giving them unlimited carry weight, i.e. they could take everything, but did not allow for this exploit to happen).

This "disappearing" was not an issue to me, because I didn't care about sold furs, and peasants were destroying only things like stacks of meat, which also would be not that interesting to re-buy.

If you fix it in the next version, could you please keep things as they are for peasants? This is not exploitable (dropped items are considered village property even if the villager was outside the village anyway), but allows to quickly identify the villages where my PC sold stuff (because there is a pile of meats somewhere in the centre square, or in the house).

Actually, since the traders won't sell the furs back, the solution could be just destroying the excessive furs, as it was.

Suggestions / Re: Rules of engagement for adventurers in the wild
« on: May 07, 2019, 12:51:50 PM »
Why just don't give "negative karma" to PC attacking non-aggressive people (except maybe robbers, I always shoot the robbers on the spot and consider it justified)? The effects of negative karma can be for example bad luck (penalty to rolls) or inability to sleep (which already sometimes happen even if you are in good standing with spirits, though this can be alleviated by some beverages).

Bug reports / Re: Thin skinned elk calf
« on: April 30, 2019, 04:17:45 PM »
This is currently most common, though I hope this will change. I had even bigger specimens of elks. And in case of reindeer it is quite common to get a calf weighing more than its mother. Size of skin is not related to the body size at all. Skin size is constant for adults, and for calves it has only a handful of values apparently, for example for elk it is usually 2.47 lbs, and value is 23.33 units (which is the most common value of skin for reindeer calf too, though they have smaller skins).

I have met only one sizeable reindeer calf, which has skin weighing 7 lbs and costing 140 units (i.e. 70% of adult values), it also was weighing 70% of species average. I suppose this is how it should work - but it was unique occurrence, in most cases it is a small skin costing 23.33, and a big, fat calf. Still, meat is expensive and fast to process, so they are not total waste of time.

EDIT: I looked at two cases of elks and bears, and it's even funnier with them than with reindeer. In both cases the cub was quite big, exactly 70% of species average for its gender, and here's the thing - it was a male, which is bigger in elks and bears than females. In case of bears this means that EVERY male cub will be bigger than its mother, unless she's above average, or it's very young (I haven't met a very young bear cub, only these seventy-percenters). Average male elk is 300 kg, female is 250 kg, average male bear is 240 kg, female is 160 kg (this changed quite recently, previously all bears were 180 kg on average). When converting to lb weight is multiplied by two and rounded up, resolution of weight differences is 1% of average size.

My two specific cases:

Elk mother 390 lbs (skin as usual 21.21 lbs, males have it at 23.33 lbs), elk calf 420 lbs (skin 2.72 lbs, i.e. 1/8.57 of adult male size).

Bear mother 263 lbs (skin as usual 23.33 lbs, males have the same size),  bear cub 336 lbs (skin 2.72 lbs, i.e. 1/8.57 of adult size, like most skins from calves and cubs). As a side note, bear skulls weight 1% of their body size, meaning that the skull from the cub was bigger than from his mother too.

General Discussion / Re: No f*cking way i would play.
« on: April 28, 2019, 09:37:22 PM »
This led me to thinking... what type of shield are Unreal World shields, exactly?  I always assumed they represented "Viking" shields, and the in-game graphic seems to support this.  However, 6 lbs is quite light for a Viking-era shield..

The thin, unfaced reproduction shields shown in the photographs on this page weigh about 5kg (11lbs), while the thicker, leather covered shields weigh more than 7kg (15lbs) when dry.
These shields are about 3 feet in diameter and 0.25 - 0.5 inches in thickness.  With the shields shown here, you can imagine how someone could almost completely protect themselves from arrows by crouching down low behind the shield.

However, the UnReal World shield appears to be different, based on the weight.  It must be smaller in diameter, or thinner, or both. It could actually be more similar to the buckler that the OP described.  I wonder if Sami or Erkka could give us their thoughts... if it is meant to be a Viking-style shield, perhaps the weight should be increased?

Yes, this the round shield in UrW represents the viking shield, which as described in the article was usually 70-100 cm in diameter (depending on the size of user). Though the shields described on the hurstwic page are at least double in weight, they are heavier reconstructions than originals obviously. Originals were from linden wood (which is lighter than many others) and were thinner (as is indicated on the page).

However, the real reason UrW use roundshield with specific size is that it was the shield used in HarnMaster (where it was based on viking shield). Here are the shield from HarnMaster third edition:
Buckler 3 lbs
Knight Shield 5 lbs
Round Shield 6 lbs
Kite Shield 7 lbs
Tower Shield 8 lbs

They are kind of light, especially the bigger ones. For some reason only the middle size is currently in the game.

By the way, as the article says, viking knew about smaller roundshields (bucklers and targes) but their main shields were bigger than these.

Okay. Let's suppose a buckler's good enough to block ALL arrows while a man is sitting crouched.
But no man can move this shield from head to legs in a 1/25s while being standing.

One turn lasts for 10 seconds I believe... Which is kinda slow, there are real world archers who can shoot about 10 arrows in that time. But that's not UnReal World :)


This sounds like a bug. Because they should use both hands to shoot (just like Player Character), and couldn't use a shield while doing so. They can, however, strap the shield to their back, then wield bow, use it, and that's probably what was happening (see the message log). Still, it should use time. Is your character slow, encumbered or wounded?

How much time's between a single move?
Theoretically 10 seconds - or more.

Why can't i see in which position they holding the shield?

I don't know - I can see the shield's position when I look at them. Are you playing current version for sure? Also it's possible (though hard to test) that if they carry the shield in neutral position (without choosing style) then it is not described in any meaningful way. But when I cared to look, the style has been always indicated, so far.

Why can't i shot them right with a dexterity=18, 36 (and 80!).

Because DEX is not important at all for this, only skill at bow, and the actual bow (some of them fail more spectacularly). Plus luck with rolls. Dexterity is used for example to determine if you drop your weapon when hit, or if you catch a tree when falling from it.

With all x at 80 moving speed is about 50 km/h while running, 15-17 while walking.
ANY other NPCs are moving maximum at 6/22 km/h and i can't outrun them.

So hacking speed above limit still increases actual speed? Nice. But apparently the limit of 10 seconds per turn still stands.

General Discussion / Re: No f*cking way i would play.
« on: April 28, 2019, 03:37:37 PM »
I have met Njerp good enough with shield to block all my arrows and javelins. Note that they can carry it in different modes (there are fours modes), with some not requiring much skill from them. I don't know what mode he used, but he probably couldn't see you while approaching, but able to block most if not all hits. If he could see, then you should try to attack his head, which is then unprotected by shield. If you attack "Body", then it can hit anywhere, but most probable parts are covered in most defending modes by shield.

Also there are not bucklers - these are big shields (they weight 6 lbs), so it's conceivable.

By the way, if you changed attributes to 18 it shouldn't affect anything, you should have changed bow skill to 100, and even then it would be affected by burden or fatigue. I suppose critical hits with bow skill at 100 could allow penetration (criticals are roughly 20% of tries), if lucky and you accidentally aimed at the part which is not protected.

Suggestions / Re: Agricultural suggestions
« on: April 25, 2019, 06:53:04 PM »
Agriculture need some touches. For example plants growing out of season is a bug of the game. I'm too lazy to check out if it was already reported, but when you re-visit a place you've been to previously, you can see such things like rye or berries ripe in April or May (all plants on a map square are affected). I sometimes exploit it, and have a harvest festival in early spring.

Also timing of planting and withering is quite rigid, and actual weather doesn't affect it too much, except in case of bugs.

General Discussion / Re: Driik fortification works against them.
« on: April 25, 2019, 06:30:07 PM »
If I were designing the game, I would add some kind of pass (gate), normally closed, which would be unlocked when the fights goes on. Or give shooting towers, with access only from inside, but giving ability to shoot over (like pine trees, some kind of fortifications). But this would only allow shooters to help, most villagers can't shoot, and shouldn't shoot.

Alternatively just teleport guys on the wall in case of emergency, as if jumped, and allow them walk off on the outer side.

When player enters the fortified village from the west, he is placed on the wall, and can choose to move inside or outside, I imagine it as a very high jump from running.

Survivors of attacks on driik villages often wander outside for the remainder of the game, I have encountered them years after the attack. If they are numerous and armoured, they will repel the next attack, but if not (like in case of the kid, or the housewife), then they most likely will die.

When you try to hang a seal skull on a tree which already has a bear skull, the seal skull is hanged, and the info that "You gracefully hang the bear skull in the pine." is displayed. I don't know if it causes the "spell" to fire, or just produces a wrong message, but it's not right.

General Discussion / Exploit - overloaded traders
« on: April 15, 2019, 09:42:58 AM »
Since introduction of limited carry weight for NPCs, there is an exploit with foreign traders. When you sell them a fur stack they can't carry, they will dump it, and you can pick it up and trade again, to this same guy or others. Normally it happens only to heaviest stack, or least expensive, but if you use only one stack, they dump it anyway, instead of splitting it, for example.

The best stacks would be elk and bear furs, with fine or superior quality, and winter variety. Because the stack needs to be quite big, it isn't exploitable by early characters, since it needs an investment in furs, pack animal (you need a pig at least), and optionally hideworking skill. Once you have so many furs, you probably don't need it, so it's more for fun of thievery than for anything else. The foreign traders came here to exploit you - you can exploit them instead!

The minimal usable stack seems to be 5 elk furs, but it's not safe, many traders are not encumbered enough to be unable to carry it, plus if you buy something heavy they are encumbered less. Stack of 6 furs is much more safe, still there are guys able to carry it. Stack of 7 can be carried only by exceptional strongmen, who need to be lightly armoured at most, and you probably won't meet them. I use stack of 8 to be sure they can't carry it. The bigger the stack the more you can buy, of course. Stack of 6 fine elk furs of winter variety (easily achievable with even mediocre skills) will buy you the most expensive weapon of masterwork quality, for example.

This exploit is not possible with villagers, because the things they drop are considered village property, even if dropped outside of village borders. It is possible with woodsmen of any sort encountered, though.

General Discussion / Re: I swear by shutters!
« on: April 15, 2019, 09:18:18 AM »
They certainly won't take everything (and I suppose they will be still there to fight you when you return), because when picking up is modelled, the carry limit is also modelled. And they dump excessive load, if somehow encumbered. So they just can't carry much.

Bug reports / Re: 3.50 villagers dying in wells (again)
« on: April 12, 2019, 09:33:04 PM »
The robbers/Njerps that have drowned in combat against my characters have done so after first tiring themselves and then getting injured into unconsciousness, which I find rather reasonable, but I've never seen someone/something tiring themselves into unconsciousness.

What I find unreasonable is that unconscious robbers on water float, instead of drowning almost instantly.

However,  drowning due to exhaustion is a completely different issue from drowning in single tile water sources without any tiring factors involved.

You can't know that.

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