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Topics - koteko

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1
I think there are a few pieces of cloth that escaped review, at the previous version.

Cloak: weights 6, 6.5 and 14 lbs for nettle/wool/fur respectively. However, it covers pretty much like a tunic (only difference: cloak covers knees where tunic covers upper arms). The tunic weights 2.8 for nettle/linen and 5 for wool, so the cloak should be reduced a bit. Incidentally, fur cloak weights too much compared to wool. Maybe a bit less? Or wool should be raised, since it should be quite a bit heavier than cloth.

Overcoat: wool weights 5.5, fur weights 15. Even worse than cloak. A bit too much difference?

Leggings: woollen 3.5, leather 2.9, fur 3.5. In other pieces of cloth, seems like leather should weight more than wool and less than fur. So here 2.9 is strange.

Undergarment: covers as much as a tunic, and less than an undershirt. However, it weights 4 for linen and 7 for wool, much more than tunic (2.8 and 5) and still more than undershirt (3 and 5), which is supposedly bigger. Incidentally, tunic and undershirt have the same weight for wool, while undershirt is bigger. I'd probably notch woollen tunic down by a bit, eg 4.7 or something.

2
Gameplay questions / Infection - does it exist?
« on: February 20, 2018, 06:38:39 PM »
Been playing for a few years, but I really don't know. There's influenza, there's bleeding wounds, normal wounds, frostbite, fractures. I've had them all and cured them all. I even survived deadly mushroom poisoning, a long time ago, I believe with a combination of sage healing, sauna and burdock (IIRC). (gotta have to try this a few times with a test character, to see the death rate, but I digress)

One thing I always assumed was in the game (because of the many herbs supposed to prevent it): infection of untreated wounds.

Has anyone had it? Is it implemented in the game at all?

If not, what do the anti-microbial, antiseptic, anti-inflammatory, vulnerary and astringent properties do? (the last one may reduce the chance of a bleeding wound re-opening, maybe. It happens often to me if I clean and dress bleeding wounds, even over days. Must try it out)

3
General Discussion / Master Trapper Challenge (alternative)
« on: February 19, 2018, 05:49:18 PM »
Inspired by this old post, I'd like to re-propose the Master Trapper Challenge with a few notable changes:

  • You must trap every one of the animals listed here (excluding the domesticated ones, and possibly snakes are untrappable?)
  • You must make a screenshot of the still-alive animal in the trap (so you can't just litter the world with traps and come back after one year with a rotten carcass - you must be an active trapper). Bonus point if you report what bait it ate once caught.
  • To win the challenge you simply have to catch the animals. If you also get superior furs out of all of them, you get bonus points.
  • You can have any character you want, even use one already started. The difficulty is not in the stats/skills, but in FINDING and capturing the animals

This acts also somewhat like a research project into discovering favourite baits and terrains for the different animals.

NB: if you decide to share your progress, I would suggest to make only one post per person (so that you can edit it when you catch more animals), and to link the screenshots externally (eg through imgur or similar services).

4
Gameplay questions / Loop snare vs light lever trap?
« on: February 19, 2018, 05:11:26 PM »
Always wondered if there was any practical difference in those. I always go with lever lever traps to use the cord somewhere else - but have you noticed better efficacy somehow?

In light levers, I caught birds, hares, squirrels, ermines and even a small fox once. The few times I've tried loops, I felt it worked equally.

There is the little matter of a new 3.5b2 spell that should make snares more appealing to hares.. maybe it doesn't work with light lever traps?

(same as fox trap vs other traps for foxes.. there's a spell that mentions the former but I don't know if works on light lever or deadfalls too)

5
Modding / Modification to Rain's Cloth mod to get wool from sheep skin
« on: February 18, 2018, 10:19:31 PM »
There is (at least?) a "shearing sheep" mod out there, but it's a hack. You cannot force the user to have an actual sheep nearby, so you can produce infinite wool.

I wanted something a bit more balanced, and I think this is it: you must kill a sheep/ram and skin it. The raw hide (not even cleaned!) can then be used to extract the raw wool fibre. At that, the great Rain's Cloth has everything you need: spindle and distaff to spin yarn from fibre (like nettle or hemp), loom to actually weave cloth and recipes to make any available woollen cloth in the game.

In particular, I differentiate between winter and summer skins (the former yields more fibre):

Quote
.Fibre from Sheep skin. "Hunting horn" [noquality] *HIDEWORKING* /1h/ [effort:3] [phys:arms,stance]
{Sheep-skin} [remove] [ground] [name:Fibre from wool] 'Skin of a sheep or ram'
{Club} '+for scutching'
{Knife}<Broad Knife>
[TILEGFX:rc-fibre]
[TYPE:tool]
[WEIGHT:2.5]

.Fibre from Winter Sheep skin. "Hunting horn" [noquality] *HIDEWORKING* /1h/ [effort:3] [phys:arms,stance]
{Winter sheep-skin} [remove] [ground] [name:Fibre from wool] 'Winter skin of a sheep or ram'
{Club} '+for scutching'
{Knife}<Broad Knife>
[TILEGFX:rc-fibre]
[TYPE:tool]
[WEIGHT:3.5]

The only difference between the two is the weight of the output "Fibre from wool" item. The weights I chose were a bit arbitrary (maybe a bit high?), but in both cases are smaller than the total weight of the skin.

Spinning just works with Rain's cloth recipe like for nettle and hemp (anything with name, "Fibre from ..."). The summer pelt yields 5 fibres, the winter one yields 7 fibres.

So here's weaving:

Quote
.Weave Woollen Cloth. "Bandage" /3h/ *AGRICULTURE* %25% [effort:2] [phys:arms,hands,stance]
{Wool Yarn}           (5) [remove] [name:Woollen Cloth]
{Loom}
[WEIGHT:2.5]
[MATERIAL:cloth]
[PRICE:3.5]
[TILEGFX:rc-cloth]

.Weave big Woollen Cloth. "Bandage" /5h/ *AGRICULTURE* %25% [effort:2] [phys:arms,hands,stance]
{Wool Yarn}           (7) [remove] [name:Woollen Cloth]
{Loom}
[WEIGHT:3.5]
[MATERIAL:cloth]
[PRICE:4.9]
[TILEGFX:rc-cloth]

Now go buy some sheep, milk it in the summer and kill it just before winter (when drying the meat, too - no waste). Plenty of time can be spent weaving cloth during winter.

Finally I have some woolen clothes I feel like I worked for :D

6
General Discussion / Farming in iron age Finland
« on: February 16, 2018, 02:03:23 PM »
I personally find it disheartening that most villages in the game have an unending supply of crops, so much that to actually BE a farmer is essentially useless unless you live in the north or in the no man's land in the far east.

Was iron age Finland like that? I've read that there were definitely times of famine, where people made bread out of tree bark. But I don't know how the average year might have looked like.

Did they actually have plenty of agricultural surplus to barter away? I somehow imagine it being more of a family subsistence thing.

PS: incidentally, it would be cool if some catastrophe happened in URW too: crops going badly (even a whole harvest worth, occasionally - that would be something to fear), bad hunting causing people to consume all the harvest (and not sell it to you!), etc. But this belongs more to suggestions I guess.

7
Bug reports / COOK_WEIGHT_DIV rounds down odd-valued nutrition
« on: February 15, 2018, 08:17:24 AM »
tested on 3.5b2

In most cases (eg, bear and elk meat) the nutrition numbers (be them fat, carbs or proteins) are multiplied by COOK_WEIGHT_DIV just as the weight is divided by it.

However, when the weight is very small and the nutrition value is odd, sometimes you get the right nutrition value and sometimes you don't.

An example is probably best to explain this.

Let's use two recipes (thanks @caethan):

Code: [Select]
.Grey sludge. *COOKERY* /1/
[SPOILAGE_DAYS:0]
[CARB:7]
[PROTEIN:3]
[FAT:5]
[WEIGHT:0.2]

.Dried sludge. *COOKERY* /1/
{Grey sludge}  [remove] [roast]
[COOK_WEIGHT_DIV:2]

If we create this grey sludge and inspect the OBJ file, the nutrition is as we defined and weight is 0.2 lbs.

When we make the Dried sludge, we get weight 0.1, fat 10, carbs 14 and proteins 6. So all good for now, the nutrition is multiplied by 2, and the weight is divided by 2 as normal.

If we set the Grey sludge's weight to 0.15, ie:

Code: [Select]
[WEIGHT:0.15]
and then we make dried sludge, we get weight 0.075, fat 8, carbs 14 and proteins 6. What happened to fat?! Everything else is multiplied by two, but it looks like fat was decreased to 4 and then multiplied by 2.

What happens if we set initial sludge weight to 0.1?

Code: [Select]
[WEIGHT:0.1]
We dry, and get: weight 0.05, fat 8, carbs 12 and proteins 4. So now all three nutritional values seem to have been rounded down.

There is something wrong for sure :)

8
Modding / Strange nutrition when "drying" berries
« on: February 14, 2018, 07:47:09 PM »
I'm using this recipe to dry blueberries, but it seems that the output has zero fat and proteins.

Code: [Select]
.Dry Berries.       *COOKERY*  /5/ \6d\   |-2|  :151:  [patch:20]
{Berries}        [remove] [roast] [name:Dried %s] [naming:original] [patchwise]
{Board} '+to set the mushrooms on' [noquality]
[SPOILAGE_DAYS:0]
[COOK_WEIGHT_DIV:2]

I also tried using WATER:0 instead of COOK_WEIGHT_DIV, with even stranger results.

These are the nutrition values I get:

  • normal blueberry: 6 carb, 1 fat, 1 protein, weight 0.1
  • dried blueberry with WATER=0: 6 carb, 0 fat, 0 protein, weight 0.1
  • dried blueberry with COOK_WEIGHT_DIV=2: 12 carb, 0 fat, 0 protein, weight 0.05

I don't really understand why I get that output with either option. Can anyone shed light? :)

9
Gameplay questions / Southern region - where art thou?
« on: February 12, 2018, 04:39:34 PM »
I was trying to find a place to live within the "Southern region".. but I'm not sure it actually exists.

According to the "flora_" files, the southern region is not as poor of herbs as the north, but it's less rich than eastern/western.

I thought - nothing's "southernest" than Reemi! But they still grow nettle, sorrel etc. So they are just "western".

Was southern a thing of the past, now removed? Or does it only cover the coast and islands to the south, and thus pretty no villages of any culture fall within its border? Or maybe islanders do?

10
Gameplay questions / Catching a glutton - advice?
« on: February 12, 2018, 02:26:41 PM »
So, I have a very persistent glutton on my camp. It raided my fenced-in cellar, killed my fenced-in pig (luckily it didn't touch my cow) and has been attempting raids for days while I'm my shelter working.

Interestingly, it completely ignored all the traps I have put around. I have light lever traps, fox traps and small deadfall outside the outer fence. I have several pit traps among the outer fence. Inside, I have one light lever, one small deadfall and one big deadfall trap. "Protected" by these traps there's an inner fence with the animals, and inside this another inner fence with the cellar.

Everything is baited with spoiled raw meat. I have a middling trapping skill, a bit above 50% I think, but have already catched a fox, a wolf, an ermine and a reindeer. All in one season, autumn, which is at an end.

Ah, I also have plenty of bones and spoiled (cooked) meat lying close to these inner traps. But so far the beast has ignored all of them - it tries to go straight to the innermost part, the cellar and the animals.

Any advice on how to tackle this thorny issue, apart from buying a dog? (I'm not self sufficient enough to support it, yet)

My character can only use axes and is huge and slow, so no chance of active-hunting the bugger.

11
Suggestions / Add "wetness" penalty to clothes
« on: August 31, 2017, 03:33:08 PM »
You are in the coldest days of winter. The "cold bar" is empty. You should stay indoor like the many game guides say, treasuring your firewood, but you don't care: you are fully clothed in deer with woollen footrags, mittens and cowl. You could dip into a frozen river and come back up, and instead of freezing to death you'd warm back to optimal.

Why? Because the warm system of clothes (which is simple but works very well, usually!) fails to take "wetness" into account.

Proposal

  • Every wearable piece must have two additional fields: wetness and wet-warmth. When wetness is full, the effective warmth is equal to the wet-warmth. When wetness is empty, the effective warmth is the usual "warmth" field for this item. If willing to go the extra mile, effective warmth decreases linearly with wetness, with minimum being the "wet-warmth" and maximum the base warmth.
  • Dipping increases the wetness very rapidly for some materials, and less for others. Linen/nettle/wool should go instantaneously to maximum wetness. Fur would only be half-wet if you go out immediately. Leather and, special case, seal fur, go 25% wet at every turn: so getting in water and coming out immediately only makes you 25% wet. I would also make the wet-warmth closer to the effective warmth for seal fur and leather (as well as iron/mail/lamellar, for all the good it'd do).
  • Rain and snow make you wet little by little, proportionally to the rain/snow strength and the material of the cloth, like above.
  • Ambient temperatures reduces the wetness with time, proportionally. Changing clothes to dry your wet ones by the fire/in your smokehouse becomes a thing.

This would make seal fur great again (as well as leather), excluding the coldest months of winter, because of its reliability under wet conditions. Your nice reindeer suite is still great but you need to keep covered, as one supposed ancient Finns did.

Extra happiness if the first to get wet is the outer layer (the last worn) for each body part, so that having a seal overcoat over your bear/stag suite makes a lot of sense.

12
Modding / Cheesemaking
« on: August 30, 2017, 03:16:55 PM »
NOTE: not tested yet! I'm putting it here to self-motivate to finish it soon, now that I've posted it :D

Taking inspiration from this website:

Quote
All the milk was made into cheese or sour milk Uusivirta writes that people in ancient times ate cheeses cooked from sour milk as their everyday food. For feast they cooked cheeses using eggs. To sour milk for to make cheese there are several ways; wild plants (for example nettle) and the stomach of certain animals (Uusivirta, Rautavaara, Israelsson). Traditional sour product is also quark, spaghanum. Butter was made by processing the milk by hand in Iron Age, since we did have no churns in Iron-Age Finland.

and to make better use of nettle (otherwise never preferred to Hemp in agriculture) and salt (never preferred to smoking/drying), I set off to make a simple setting-appropriate cheesemaking recipe.

The idea is the following: first you need "rennet" (only vegetable-based here), which will spoil after a few days. The rennet allows fast curdling of the milk, thus giving you "cheese".

Quote
.Nettle Rennet. *COOKERY* /30/ %10% |1| [effort:1] :148:
{*nettle leaves} #1# [remove] [boil]
{Water} #1# [remove] [boil]
{Salt} #0.1# [remove] [boil]
[SPOILAGE_DAYS:5]

.Sorrel Rennet. *COOKERY* /15/ %10% |1| [effort:2] :148:
{*sorrel leaves} #1# [remove] [boil]
{Water} #0.1# [remove] [boil]
{Knife}<Small knife>
{Wooden bowl} '+as support'
[SPOILAGE_DAYS:2]

.Fresh Cheese. *COOKERY* /15/ \1d\ %10% |0| [effort:1] :148:
{Milk}    #5#    [remove] [roast]
{*rennet} #0.3#  'Rennet for curdling'  [remove] [roast]
{Salt}    #0.1#  [remove] [roast]
{Bandage} '+to drain the whey' [remove]
{Pot} '+to boil the milk'
{Wooden bowl} '+to mould the cheese'
[TILEGFX:it-fcheese]
[SPOILAGE_DAYS:10]
[COOK_WEIGHT_DIV:1.5]

.Wrapped Cheese. *COOKERY* /15/ \30d\ %10% |-1| [effort:0] :148:
{Fresh Cheese} [remove] [roast]
{Nettle Leaves} #1# '+as wrapping' [remove] [roast]
[TILEGFX:it-wcheese]
[SPOILAGE_DAYS:300]
[COOK_WEIGHT_DIV:1.5]

TODO:

  • graphic tiles for rennet and cheeses
  • test if total quantity fits a pot
  • maybe separate the nettle/sorrel rennet production from the cheese, so that people can use any rennet they want. (and in the future, also make rennet from lamb stomach)
  • this is a soft, perishable cheese. It would be great to differentiate "soft" and "hard cheese" by making two different recipes starting from this "very soft cheese" and letting them mature for a few days (soft) or weeks (hard). The former might have a few months of shelf life, the latter being essentially non-perishable (or, say, two years spoilage time)

PS: here there's the full process with pictures! (only for nettle rennet)

13
So, like the title say - turnip seeds can be used as "Vegetable" ingredients, while hemp seeds can only be seasoning. Interestingly, turnip seeds can also be used as Seasoning.

14
General Discussion / Culture Poll
« on: August 29, 2017, 04:27:01 PM »
I've been looking into the different cultures, and trying to play as all of them. Apart from the stats/skills differences, it's quite cool to actually travel to their lands and live according to their customs. I wish there were more marked differences, more lore, more interactions but I'll patiently wait for future updates :)

In the meanwhile, I'm curious as to what you guys play the most, or which culture you love the most even if you play it little (some are objectively hard!).

I personally used to be a Owl-guy, and never really liked the Kaumo (luckly, they are not the only "big guys"). Nowadays I love Seal for active hunting (spear & club) and Reemi for passive hunting and some farming.

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Guides and tutorials / Choose the starting Culture based on skills
« on: August 28, 2017, 04:00:35 PM »
Here is a short commentary/guide to the starting cultures, based on the simple analysis of the starting skill bonuses/maluses. This should help any beginner looking to make things smoother for themselves.. or harder, if masochistic :)

  • Reemi, Sarto, Kaumo and Kiesse are quite versatile tribes, with bonuses far outweighing the maluses. Good choice for beginners, especially if the right tribe is chosen for a specific play style (eg, choose Sarto for agriculture-related characters, Kaumo for warriors and active hunters, Reemi for trappers and Kiesse for the prototypical woodsman.)
  • Owls have many maluses (which reduces their versatility in using multiple weapons and wood/construction stuff, but also fishing), but are probably the best active hunters (Kaumo is easier to play overall but takes more grinding to raise some important skills). This is your bow-sniper character, able to track down quickly the prey, kill it and produce high-quality hides, as well as identify useful herbs.
  • Seal tribes are not as bad as you would think from their -4. They are the best spear-users, club-users, fishers and "shamans". Their stealth bonus is also good. They make fun (and reality-appropriate) seal-hunters if you don't go the easy way (eg, traps): sneak up, throw your javelin/spear and club to death. I enjoyed playing as one.
  • Driik seem very "poor", but they have the best sword, shield and crossbow bonuses. Most other tribes have maluses there, or at best a zero. They might make for interesting atypical characters.
  • Islanders are the best weather predictors.. which is sadly useless (maybe for some quests? not sure). They can only swim, fish and carve wooden objects better than default, and have plenty of important maluses. More "carpentry" options (eg, fishbone carvery?) might make them more appealing in the future.
  • Kuikka are essentially lesser Owl that can fish very well (like Islanders and Seal-tribe), and carve wooden objects decently. Never got interested in playing as one.
  • Koivulanen.. these are weird. They have good Agriculture, like the Sarto, and also small tracking&trapping bonuses. They have a bonus to the least used weapon, the flail. That's it - however, they also lack significant maluses. Herblore & Physician only. So they make for the real average man, which can be interesting for the expert player.



Source of the above: the ini_skills.txt shipped with the game. I uploaded it on the wiki for easy consultation.

I found the actual file a bit hard to read - a table works much better. Also, I prefer a bonus/malus view (eg, difference compared to the default) instead of the absolute numbers.

It would be great to also have a table for attribute bonuses.. what we have was found empirically a long time ago and I'm not sure how accurate it is.

I find, however, that when planning a character I care more about the skills than the attributes, since I'm a heavy roller to get high values (or I even correct the attributes manually, if I can't be bothered to roll). So it doesn't affect me overmuch.

(URW version 3.4)

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