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Re: Improvements to fire mechanics, changes to smoking mechanics
There's also option to use smoking teepee, instead of parachute, I'd reckon cavemen and folks since could've used animals hides.


Stuff like this is exactly what we need (IMHO of course). Nothing complicated, historically accurate and definitely flavour adding. Just gotta make sure there is room for cheese. Gotta have, just GOTTA HAVE smoked cheese man!

May 20, 2020, 08:29:01 PM
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Re: Does BAC reduce realism? Odd thing on the forum this the exact same original post as also recently posted on the forum but under a different user name.

ITs over here at:
https://www.unrealworld.fi/forums/index.php?topic=5533.0

I will duplicate my reply here with:

Well, now. Didn't expect that question.

Fair disclosure: I'm Brygun. The B in the BAC mod. Organizer of the mod from its various sources including my own addittions.

So where to being:

Q: Is play balance different with BAC?
A: Yes
Of course it does. There is many ways to get different tools or results other than the options in the vanilla game.
Ways of generating wealth bundled up in ways of entertaining your self with role playing whittle a board game. Even if the game tracks how much of a different good is sold that there exists multiple new items means you could profit by selling them to a village.

Q: Does it change realism?
Well what is your reference for realism? Many, though not all, players are modern urbanites enjoying the game as a trip to the woods. I'm a bit urbanized but also grew up in the country side running around in forest was normal. It was a very safe wood without bears or lynxes or wolverines or Nerjpez to worry about.

Q: Is there realism basis for items in the BAC?
A: Yes
In fact if you open up the diy_BAC_XXXX.txt files I specifically included references including links to youtube videos you can watch. Those certainly show there is realism is the mod.

Q: Did item XXX exist in real world Iron Age Finland?
Oh now there is a varied question. Item by item of all items would be too much so here is a few. Again many others have references in the .txt file comments.
= As a Canadian with a tradition of birch bark canoes I put it in yet as Saami, maker of Unreal World and a native Finlander, pointed out is the sort of birch trees in Finland are different so they probably couldn't even made at all.
= The largest of the boats, the clinkered punt, is a combination of the steamed open tree logs known to Finland plus the clinkering and caulking of what is known for sure in later ages but possible in that age.
= The steps for making iron come from Rain's Ironworking mod and do indeed match up to my own studies of blacksmithing in that period. I was surprised to find that lake ore is a real thing. I thought it was a quirky gamey thing but low and behold if one looked into it this actually is realism. Secret: Finland has/had so much surface and near-surface iron ore that it flowed down with the rains into rivers into lakes. In the lakes, like the bogs, biological processes pulled it out and tended to make it into clumps mixed with non-iron. Thus you did need to roast the lump of lake ore (or bog ore) and process.

= Back strap weaving is a real world thing. I believe there is a video for that in the .txt files.

=  Cordage is easier to make in BAC through various real world ways. Only the recent 3.60 ish (IIRC) added the withe making. Prior to that it took capturing animals to get leather to get the cords to hang meat to dry in the winter. A rather recursive if you have it (an animal kill) you can do it but if don't have it you can't do it (if that makes sense). In my own research I looked into real world ways for making cordage, like digging up spruce roots, and added them in. Real = yes. Changing the play balance = yes.

Part of the BAC goals was to include things that were known or plausible to teach woodland survival skills. Thats why the Shaman mod was excluded, that is well researched but deals with a metaphysical.

If you are new to UnReal World you might want to give a few goes at playing without the mod. It can be added mid-play or removed. The way Unrweal World recipes work once an item is created its properties are assigned to the instance thus not needing an ongoing reference. IF there is a graphic custom that might end up being empty but it should still show up in the list if you stand on a tile to pick it up. Of course without  the mod you don't need a Ball Hammer.

Good question. Think I will add the answers to the BAC forum and the text files.

>>>>

And its follow up reply of:

I'd also like to point out that a lot computer games today get crafting wrong. The do it wrong on purpose. They create artificial values and needs based on the programmers following popular tricked perceptions or to have things break to give players something to do again and again.

On tricked perceptions: Gold
Gold is a soft metal that stays shiny and conducts electricity. It is also very heavy. It is utter rubbish for making armor and weapons. The real world Kings of Europe had full plate armor of >steel< with >gold as pretty trim<. Many games make you want to use gold as something like a pick axe to pound on volcanic granite rock. Utter non-sense.

On having things break to give you repetitive things to do: Minecraft pick axe
Pick axes of real world miners last for how long? Sure a mining company will wear through them. Sure they need to be sharpened now and then. They last for weeks or months. You don't have to take a shipment of pick axes for your 8-hours of work. By having the tool break the player of the game is now forced to go to the same parts of the game world to gather the same materials. It is forcing repetition.
To be honest I love it in Fallout 4 running mods where I have to go hunt copper for the casing of my modded in .50 caliber semi-automatic anti-material rifle my power armor character uses. Bullets though really are one use except for that copper (really bronze) casing falling to the ground which could be gathered up again.

Award for worse realism in a computer game goes to Minecraft for making players strive to get the so called high quality tool of a Gold Pickaxe that breaks regularily.

#2 for the award also goes to Minecraft for the diamond headed pick axe. Seriously. You want to poke fun at realism in a computer game try to find a real world example of a diamond headed pick axe.






May 23, 2020, 04:43:00 AM
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Re: Improvements to fire mechanics, changes to smoking mechanics Can't wait for all the new stuff. And I'm not sure if it's already been suggested or not yet, but when you spoke about embers and smoke, I started thinking of some additions for the scaled out travel map in relation to that, what if you could discover fires made in villages, some smoke a couple tiles farther than the village itself if you have a high enough ability in the eye statistic, and perhaps -if it isn't already implemented in the AI- it's been a while since I've been able to play so I don't know if NPC's outside villages make fires, but if they do, maybe you could spot smoke from that too, farther out and easier than seeing the people making them.
May 24, 2020, 07:38:20 AM
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Return the action pictures The game used to have pictures for the actions that your character did and also a framebox for your character build. A 4 year old post on steam says that "they were (temporarily) removed because of developmental and technical and practical reasons. They might return in some future version, but can't promise yet.". I waited and waited... and waited, but after 4 years they are still gone.
The pictures made the game more immersive and would really like to see them return.

June 11, 2020, 07:54:06 AM
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Re: A Hunting Goshawk It's not unheard of for my early characters to steal the kill from hunting birds (once, I think I've even stole the kill from a wolf, before legging it).
June 18, 2020, 02:29:54 PM
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Re: A Hunting Goshawk That is such good idea falconry...
June 19, 2020, 02:40:42 PM
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How to Trap for Pleasure and Profit; A Rough Guide This is a rough guide to trapping as well as is ongoing. Game mechanics are known to changes often and so does player knowledge base. As such I will be adding and editing as I go to improve the guide and keep it up to date. This guide doesn’t rely on trading, nets or fishing rods or even active hunting or murdering NPCs. This is how to survive on trapping alone. I would suggest as starting off as a trapper in Summer as the shovel is so much better than the wooden shovel.

The biggest thing about trapping is where you call your territory. The best spots are near lakes and rivers, they act as natural barriers and drive prey into the traps. The best location is tucked against a series of lakes, connected with land bridges.

There are 3 traps that is best for the early game. The most useful is the Light Lever Trap. It only costs a slender trunk, 2 branches and a stone. You will need a knife as well. It catches birds, hares, pine martens, polecats, foxes, weasels and probably more that I am forgetting.

The next is the Paw Board Trap which only costs a board. You will need an axe and knife. It catches Foxes; regular and arctic. It is cheap to make, unwanted ones can be traded or burnt. Foxes bring in 4-8lbs of meat and a valuable fur.

Finally, the Pit Trap. Most labour intensive and well as costs 3 slender trunks, 10 branches, 10 spruce twigs and you will need to dig a pit first with a shovel. This catches all the big game: bears, elk, reindeer, seals, wolves and boars.

Once you have found a location you are happy with, near a series of almost connected lakes or near a river, build yourself a shelter and a raft with paddle. Stack the raft with slender trunks, branches and twigs and stones. Paddle up and down your shelter square, building lever traps along the shoreline. I would suggest leaving 3-5 spaces between each trap. A good lake trap line will bring in many mallards and ducks. Great for early game food. Do this to all the shore fronts nearby. Check them every day or twice. You can get kills stolen from traps by foxes and goshawks. Use your raft to easily paddle to check them, plus you will scare lake and river birds into your traps.

Once you have a day’s food or two, start building your paw board traps. They will work without bait but not as well. The best location, I have found is open mires and ground tiles to snag foxes. It is easy to check all your traps without moving. I tend to place 7-10 in a rough circle and if I don’t have enough to bait them, I put one bait in the middle, at least as a draw to the trapping area. These should be checked once every 3-5 days.

Now the big earners, the pit traps. If you are near interconnecting lakes with land bridges, you have hit the gold mine. In the little ground between the two lakes, dig a few pit holes and make the traps. Place the fences so anything coming this way would follow the coast and fall into one of your pits. If you don’t have interconnecting lakes, just build one from the riverbank or lake bank out. I tend to do pit traps every 3 tiles. The only herd animals are reindeer, pigs and wolves and even if you catch all the herd then the meat or fur would spoil before you could process all 5-10 animals. I rather lessen the work and grab only 3 animals. I dig about 7 pit traps out, fence it and then leave it, checking as often I do for fox traps.

You can bait with berries, vegetables and meat. Early game when I do not have a sauna, if I get an early big game like elk and cannot eat it all, I only cook what I can eat, and the spoiled raw meat goes into fox traps.  Elk love turnips and will happily go into pit traps for one. Berries will drive birds into your lever traps. A smart trapper will set up their lever traps around or on a berry bush to draw game to it. Foxes like meat, they act like dogs and will not take spoiled cooked meat.

Seal trapping is more of a novelty than anything  is actually a great way to get early loot. You can trap seals in trap pits and big dead fall traps. The dead fall traps are worth setting up on skerries if you see seals in the area. Trap pits work too but needs to be dug in ground right on the shore.

To live as a Seal Trapper, all you need is a raft with some rope, logs and slender trunks and you can check the east coast tile by tile and live off of seals. I found I can trade 5-6 regular grey seal furs for a bag of salt, which you can then salt 210lb of meat with. In fall you can just dry the meat or if you have a smokehouse built you can smoke the meat. You get 20-175lb of meat depending on the size of the seal and type. Ringed seals are smaller than grey. It very much an active pastime but well worth it actually.

There is also living bait traps. There are people who use bought animals such as sheep as living bait, tying them to a tree and making a double ring of traps around the animal in order to tempt lynxes, wolves and bears into traps. I figure why risk your sheep when a smoked elk cut would do the same. Once a trap has triggered and the animal is dead, animals and NPCs can walk over them so with a wolf pack, the third wolf would get the sheep.

There are of course other traps in the game, the simplest is the snare. It costs 3ft of cord. I rarely use these as require cordage, which early game I rarely have and later game, when I have cordage to spare, I am onto trap pits and have lever traps already set up.

Small and big deadfall traps cost more than light lever traps and require tying equipment. The small deadfall traps may catch badgers and gluttons but they are rare. I usually set these around cellars and dog feeding zones to stop scavengers such as them and foxes. Big dead fall traps catch what small dead falls do and lynxes and wolves which are rare once again. I would use them if I see tracks of those around or see them on the map but I wouldn’t make them otherwise as if they are triggered, they often kill the animal outright meaning you only have a few days to recover the bodies versus  up to a week in Pitfalls. You can use withes for these which lower the "cost" of building.

Heavy Dead Fall Bear Traps catch the same animals as Pitfalls but doesn’t need a hole. They do work with fences as well.  They do require tying equipment which makes them for mid game or working on over winter when the ground is too frozen to dig.

There is some ritual based things you can do regarding traps. When you bait a Bear Dead Fall Trap, do so naked to increase your chances to get a bear in it. Fox traps should be baited in the evening to increase chances. Another one is to leave fox traps in a doorway so women walk over them. (Anyone tested if female player characters count?) For snaring hares, wear mittens preferably woolen ones to increase chances.

I stress that this is a rough guide; you might find that you do better with snares or maybe deadfalls but I  just wanted to provide a little guidance to trapping and how to live off it.

Good luck and happy trapping.



June 20, 2020, 06:17:27 PM
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Re: Is reindeer ranching feasible? Breeding animals hasn't been implemented yet, nor do reindeer provide milk. Only sheep and cows can be milked during the summer period.
June 23, 2020, 05:39:31 AM
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Re: Kota My guess, without having built a kota for years, is that you've made it too small so it actually only has a single tile of space in it. If possibly try to compare your kota with the ones in the game and see if yours are smaller (you might start a new character in an easy start up in the north and walk to the nearest village).
June 23, 2020, 11:17:56 PM
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Roleplaying So considering that roleplaying is always more fun way to play games such as these one, I was wondering what are you guys doing when roleplaying?

Heres the few ideas from me, When I smoke meat in some village I always leave part of meat as payment for giving me access to their fireplace, I like also befriending some village give them gifts, trade etc. When I sacrifice I try to find some nice place to do it, No hunting or sparing of Calfs, Respecting the prey- I try not to just throw the meat I consider all life precious so If I can't smoke it, trade it, I gift it, And in general when I play I try to give meaning to my character life and things he does, so not just random walking, hunting just for sake of it.

Also, the starting scenario is taken into account, culture etc.

June 26, 2020, 06:35:23 PM
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anything